Piecemeal parking zones could be scrapped in favour of a city-wide requirement for permits to put an end to the repeated pattern of displacement when a new zone is created.
Conservative councillor Samer Bagaeen suggested the creation of a city-wide parking zone when Brighton and Hove City Council’s Transport and Sustainability Committee met on Tuesday 26 March.
And the opposition leader, Green councillor Steve Davis, said that drivers were parking ever closer to the edges of Brighton and Hove with the creation of each new parking zone.
They were taking part in a debate about “light-touch” parking zones and a city-wide review of parking policy which Labour announced last year and which is still under way.
Councillor Bagaeen said that the current incremental approach to parking zones had not worked because it just “pushes the problem along”.
He said: “We’ve seen that at Surrenden and at the top of Dyke Road, in Wayland Avenue, which we said, when it came to committee, would move the parking problem to Westdene.
“May I suggest parking permits across the whole city up to the boundary – and if that’s something that the strategic review will recommend, I really think that’s the way forward.”
Councillor Davis said that the outskirts of the city were not a “parking utopia” because the roads were becoming swamped with displaced vehicles.
He said: “Car ownership has doubled in the last 20 years and we’ve run out of parking space. I’ve been coming here for five years and it’s just like slamming your head against the wall.
“We recently had a parking zone in Surrenden, and this was voted through in a minority administration, and now the residents of Patcham, in particular, Withdean Court Avenue and the Cedars, are struggling a lot.
“Residents can’t wait. It’s an onslaught. What would the administration’s view be on having a city-wide parking zone?”
He also asked when the parking review would be published since it had been “almost a year”.
Labour councillor Trevor Muten, who chairs the committee, said that his party’s new administration initiated the parking review last summer shortly after winning a majority at the local elections.
Councillor Muten said that Labour halted plans to treble parking charges in the area around the Royal Sussex County Hospital, in Brighton.
He said: “I would agree that it’s beyond time. This should have been resolved several years ago.
“We’ve picked this up as a new administration and we’ve worked out that the strategy, if there was one for parking, hasn’t worked very well for the city.
“We have problems in so many different places. We’ve got people paying very high parking fees which are probably unsustainable.”
Councillor Muten agreed that when a new zone was created, many drivers parked in nearby non-permit areas for weeks at a time.
Brighton and Hove’s parking problems could not be solved by adding more parking zones “patched on to the end” of existing ones, he said.
Councillors did, though, agree to keep the existing “light-touch” parking zones, where a resident or visitor permit is required for an hour twice a day.
The council had considered scrapping light-touch schemes, which discourage people from leaving vehicles for more than a few hours at a time. Instead, they would have become full parking zones, with restrictions from 9am to 8pm.
Councillor Muten said that the decision was likely to mean £300,000 less income than forecast in the budget.
But, he said, the decision reflected public opinion after 2,755 responses to the council’s consultation, with 2,268 of those wanting their area to remain a “light touch” parking zone.
Before they bring in Mafia-touch citywide parking zones the council should consider the 2013 Barnet High Court judgement and consider it well. They are not permitted to profit from street parking. They are not supposed to charge any more than a parking scheme costs to administrate. As for senior citizen bus passes not being funded without parking fees, they are reimbursed for those by Central Govt.
http://www.racfoundation.org/media-centre/barnet-council-loses-parking-charges-case
Probably the most ignored piece of law in most councils in the UK.
When are BHCC going to learn. Parking zones citywide are just going to destroy the tourist industry in this city.
This city relies on the tourist trade to survive Why should tourists come here if they can’t park without incurring exorbitant charges.
I do not drive a car and never have. I was born in Brighton in 1966 and live in Hollingdean.
Subsequent councils over the last 40 years have seen drivers as a soft touch to make money.
Visitors are already staying away from this city . They opt to go to other towns where parking charges are a lot less .
Use common sense BHCC. The higher the price of parking in this city the less people will visit.
I think that subsequent councils over the last 40 years have done their best to kill the tourist industry.
IllI thought out a schemes are going to destroy this city. Ian Beck
Of course they are not.
We have had parking zones in the city centre for years. Far more people come by train than car to visit the city.
Go to Amsterdam where 10,000 city centre parking spaces have been removed to improve the city for people. Go to Paris where on street parking is v limited and restricted to 2 hrs max. These places do not lack tourists and these measures increase their number because car dominated places are just not nice to spend time in.
The sooner we can move on from this ridiculous and harmful motor mindset, the better.
This is Brighton not Amsterdam
Paris has some awful driving standards, you know how they make space for cars? They barge them.
luckily not everyone comes to Brighton by car
This isn’t an idea favoured by the Labour group and they run the council, so it isn’t going to happen ! It was a suggestion by a Conservative councillor, which a Green councillor agreed with but both parties have only a handful of councillors, so they will never get this through at the moment. It’s NOT a Labour plan and so it isn’t going to happen whilst Labour are in charge !
Parking is a mafia racket in our city.
Undemocratic money grab.
There will be more digging up of Gardens to provide off Street parking and hence more flooding.
By a Conservative Councillor and supported by a Green but it is NOT going to happen, as Labour now run the city and this is not in their plans!
Regardless, it is creating some interesting discussion, even theoretical.
Two points from me
1) is it fair to treble parking charges around the RSCH ? Obviously not, most people are either getting out patient care or visiting sick relatives.
2) the idea of a city wide scheme is not actually as bad as it sounds
. The way to stop ‘Semi abandoned’ vehicles parked for weeks on end, in uncontrolled areas, is to make a bylaw that says ‘ Maximum parking 24 hours – no return for 6 hours’.
When Hollingdean had its recent parking survey, I pointed out that there is no actual parking problem if you removed vehicles parked for weeks on end, mainly thanks to
Students from nearby zoned area accomodation
Commercial vehicles where the driver has no permit for zoned parking for that vehicle
Garage repair business parking
Second and third cars from households in nearby zoned parking
If you stop parking by vehicles for weeks on end you go a long way to solving a problem
Interestingly, I think people visiting the hospital should not access to paid parking on the roads. The hospital has parking on site, so I’d actively campaign to remove all the paid parking in favour for resident only parking.
There’s also a balance between the price of the road and in the hospital to consider beyond that thought, make one more than the other and you displace parking into and out of the hospital.
Descusting of the councle greedy greedy, why not hav a proper vote so the people who live in the areas decide.
They did. Only 41% turned up for the local elections.
This is NOT from Labour. This article is about a suggestion from a Tory councillor, and was supported by a Green councillor. But Labour now run the city and this city wide permit parking is NOT going to happen.
It’s important to understand what we are trying to achieve here and I’m not sure that’s clear. Incremental imposition of zones does just displace the issue but a city-wide zone would discourage the visitors upon which our city depends for much of its income.
Surely the provision of well advertised and easy to use park and rides has to be part of the solution. Recently visited York and they work brilliantly.
Increased Park and Ride are so important, I am still surprised the aspect of P&R is not more deeply explored, especially in conjunction with some of the major workplaces in Brighton, such as the AE and RSCH buildings.
Park and ride is just not a viable or helpful option for our city. This may sound counterintuitive but it is the case.
This is why it has been the opposition policy of labour for all of this century and is promptly mothballed when they are in power. They tend to commission a feasibility report which goes straight into the long grass.
The Green Party has been the only one to properly acknowledge the problems with p&r and the integrity to not use it as a populist banner which they know they can’t deliver
Don’t worry..this is not going to happen in the near future, as Labour run the city and it isn’t a Labour plan. It was a suggestion from a conservative councillor and was supported by a Green councillor. But they do NOT run the city now.
The ‘maximum parking 24 hours – no return for 6 hours’ idea wouldn’t work as it would penalise anyone who parks for more than 24 hours, including residents? But agree that a citywide scheme could be considered, rather than just keep pushing the problem onto the next neighbourhood. It might be a bitter pill but will be inevitable once the last outer neighbourhoods are swamped, residents demand permit restrictions and there’s nowhere left to park for free. So perhaps we should just get it done now.
You could offer exceptions to the max 24 hrs no return within 6hrs by issue of permits to residents in that zone.
The problem is out of area parking by infrequent users of their vehicles who won’t or can’t buy a permit for their own vehicle. I have seen cars in the Hollingdean area literally parked for weeks. A 24hr max would force these vehicles to at least keep moving rather than bed blocking roads
The main problem with a city wide parking zone is where would all the other vehicles go By this I mean the work vans, motor homes and other large vehicles that can’t be parked in controlled zones. We need a secure parking area or we will harm vital local businesses and their employees. That will just drive more families out of the city.
We do need a strategy for the city as it’s been clear for years the current one doesn’t work. However, just making a city-wide zone won’t work either as that ignores many of the reasons why the current schemes don’t work and out of area parkers just drive the zones outwards.
Don’t worry. It isn’t going to happen, as a city wide parking permit zone is not supported by Labour and they run the city. This was a suggestion by a conservative councillor and supported by a green councillor but they no longer run the council
What a bunch of idiots. If this is the best they can come up with they need medical attention.
R.I.P Brighton and Hove
Thanks Tom for the deeply insightful, well balanced take on a complex problem.
To think that before the internet you would not have had a voice.
Luckily, this idea is not supported by Labour, who now run the city. It was just an idea from a tory councillor and liked by a green councillor. This does not mean a thing , as it’s Labour who creates policies and they don’t like this idea at all !
That’s the Tory’s for you half a brain and let’s tax tax and more tax, let’s under stand when this all came in it started when legal and general was in have and the streets where swamped after that it moved across the city, so remember where you put your close next time
Please try to be grammatical when trying to insult someone’s intelligence, it severely undermines one’s credibility before they even read the content of what you’re trying to say.
I think illustrates the quality of the comment very well.
Nobody has mentioned Portslade. We are a large part of B&HCC. Parking in my road has become terrible since the parking permits were brought in to Hove up to Boundary road. As previously mentioned by others, lorries, van, cars all park here for days and either get in another car or go to Fishergate railway station or nearby bus stop. It really is past the time when councillors consider the residents who live in these roads
I think your experience highlights why if parking zones are going to be the whole of Brighton & Hove anyway, it’s better to do the whole area in one big push, rather than incrementally.
There is no problem with making the parking for “Permit Holders Only”. The problem comes with charging for the permit. Once they charge for the permit then it is just a money grab and they will keep increasing the cost whenever they need more money, and they always need more money.
They would also need to provide visitor permits FoC to any household that wants them.
parking zones have to be self funding
Yes, the zones should be self-funding (although some councils make a small loss). B&H council makes a huge profit – around £20m. Technically this isn’t allowed. A small profit, so you don’t make a loss is OK -but the effective extra tax we have is not permitted. At some point, someone will legally challenge and the city could well be in a mess. Without the parking money, budgets from elsewhere will have to fund statutory bus passes etc. And that means cuts to non-statutory services like libraries, parks, leisure, toilets etc etc.
You don’t even drive Derek. You care not for anyone who does or needs to.
Oh, Barry, that’s an appeal to authority fallacy. It’s not a logical argument to make I’m afraid. The validity of an argument is cannot be judged based on the credentials or lack thereof of the person making the argument, rather than on the merits of the argument itself. It’s important to evaluate arguments based on their content rather than on the personal attributes of the individuals presenting them.
They haven’t thought it through. They’ll put some nonsense scheme in place and when it all goes wrong they’ll come up with some excuse and PR Bullshit to justify their incompetence. Looks like a total cock up waiting to happen from where I’m standing.
What would you suggest would be a sensical scheme?
The truth is I don’t know as it’s a hugely complex problem but I know a dud when I see one and this is a dud.
That’s fair enough, I respect that.
Don’t worry, it isn’t going to happen, as Labour do not support this idea and Labour now run the city
I would support the proposal to give permits and zones to all residents on two conditions:
1. The costs for all permits to decrease . No profiting.
2. Car parks have reduced rates for overnight parking and less expensive parking city wide.
I think there’s a strong reason to lower the prices of all permits citywide since the increase in permit usage should reasonably justify this. And to be fair, most car parks do, in fact, have reduced rates for overnight parking. Less expensive parking citywide wouldn’t go amiss, I’m sure.
No, wait a minute. If this goes ahead, someone explain this to me – and I’m not complaining to or about anyone, but I can’t figure it out. A vehicle drives into the city for a one-off visit – tourists say. They’ve never been here before. According to the council website there are still payment machines at a handful of council-controlled barrier car parks (I don’t know if that’s still true as I don’t drive, but it’s what the website says today), but how does the casual visitor know all that and such car parks may be nowhere near where the visitor wants to go anyway. Mostly they’ve removed the machines from everywhere (streets and car parks) and you have to pay by app on a mobile phone or, they say on the website, call a number and use your credit/debit card, or search for a Paypoint outlet, even though you don’t know the city and can’t take the car to find an outlet under the suggested new regime. It seems to me that this would be enough to deter a fair few one-off visitors who are quite possibly used to finding a car park handy to where they want to go and sticking some coins in a machine for the period of hours they intend to stay. Why would they bother with all that, especially if they were just popping in casually for a few hours hours to have a look round and spend some money on the usual touristy things, such as food, ice cream, souvenirs or whatever. If this plan goes ahead, then at the same time there needs to be a very simple and workable fix to the payment issue for one-off visitors, surely. Otherwise, you might just as well pop along to somewhere like Seaford, where, to the best of my knowledge, there is still a fair bit of free parking or pay by machine parking.
Yeah, there are indeed payable machines around, Black Lion Street Car Park, by Brighton Town Hall, for example. These are well-signed, to be fair.
Visitors who can’t use a parking app aren’t that valuable to our tourist economy. The inflation/exchange rate is prohibitive if you’re visiting the city from _the nineteen seventies._
It’s not going to happen! Labour runs the city, not the Tories, who suggested this would be a good idea
Lots of parking in Seaford, Eastbourne, Lewes, Worthing…….bye bye Brighton.
Buy Buy Worthing
So the residents on the very edges of the city where parking is not yet a problem and do not want controlled parking ,will not have a say in the matter and will be forced to pay the rediculous fee for a permit or pave over their green front gardens to get their car off the highway, motorists already pay huge vehicle excise duties to use the highway at present,so much for democracy.
No, because it isn’t going to happen , as Labour does NOT support this idea and it is Labour who now runs the city
Disgusting money grab…imposed zones move parking because they’re unfair…cars are the lifeblood of the suburbs
They do move parking absolutely, we’ve seen this happen before with new zones being added, which I think is why if they were going to introduce them incrementally, it’d make sense to just do the whole city at once.
Don’t like what’s going on?
Email your complaint to Mark Prior, Head of Transport at BHCC, who is ultimately responsible for this plan.
His details are in the public domain.
“email your complaint to Mark Prior” are you having a laugh. Do you honestly believe he gives a damn?
Would do literally nothing. Because that’s not the forum to raise your objections. If you’re gonna complain, and you should if you feel strongly about this, do it via the correct method otherwise, it’s a waste.
Correct – Mr Prior would do nothing. He believes he is unaccountable for his actions. His salary is £85k, which presumably comes out of residents’ council tax payments.
Something seriously wrong here
It isn’t a plan though ! It was just a suggestion by a tory councillor and supported by a green councillor but it is Labour who now run the city and it is NOT a plan of Labour’s, so it is NOT going to happen.
Need to develop a decent out of city park and ride for the visitors to use. Keep the cars out of town.
So let me get this straight!
They poll people if they want parking outside their homes between;
a) Monday to Friday .
b) Monday to Saturday .
No third choice of we don’t want parking at all?
When they have a ‘so-called democratic’ poll with the tesult being say 54% against, the council then goes to nearby area and adds them to the poll result so they can get the result THEY WANTED in favour of parking permits!
As new areas are now seeing these polls and parking permits as nothing more than a stealth tax adding £160 to your council tax, these new areas are overwhelmingly rejecting parking permits and saying we don’t want parking permits at all!
So as these thieves in the council are absolutely DETERMINED to sting council tax payers for more money, as this is going to be the only way that councils are going to raise funds (as the Conservative Government refuses to allocate sufficient funds to councils to fund all their services), these thieves are going to foist it on us anyway despite being overwhelmingly being rejected by the public !!!
And they call this democracy?
Al Capone was jailed for less than this!!!
Ironically, Al Capone was jailed for tax evasion.
Your argument is that you don’t want parking at all? I mean, it’s a bit extreme and I don’t think Brighton is ready to be a pedestrian-only city.
Assuming that you mean you don’t want to pay for parking charges, do you have enough private land to be able to park on? Or are you so entitled that you think that the council should provide you with 2m x 4m of public space for free?
I wont pay to park personally out of principle, if that means i take my business elsewhere thats up to the council, i wont pay them for the privilege of shopping in their town and will shop elsewhere instead. I do feel bad having to do this being brighton born and bred, but they dont want us here (or want us to pay for the privilege) so will spend money in more friendly places instead. I do feel sorry for the businesses that losr out as a result though, bet they will have to increase prices to stay afloat – if they can manage that at all with the current
regime)
Okay. Evidence shows little difference in footfall from parking restrictions. If you feel the need to go elsewhere to prove a point, please go ahead. I suspect no one will know or care, I’m afraid.
Although you might be Brighton born and bred, you’ve clearly not visited in a very long time. There’s been no free parking in the city centre for a while now.
No, because Labour now runs the city and this isn’t a Labour idea/plan. It was just a suggestion by a tory councillor. That’s all ! Labour are NOT doing this !
So wat about the cars who park on wide pavements they obviously do not have a permit out side thier work spot.look at 5 ways ditchling rd.why should we pay for resdence parking wen these other drivers do not
Wow, they really don’t listen to us do they?far to busy trying to concoct their next money grabbing scheme. They have ruined this town witb their ill thought out measures, you can’t go to the shops eithout them trying to charge you to park so businesses lose out on custom. 15 minute cities by stealth?
As I said, businesses show little difference in footfall from parking restrictions.
On the topic of 15-minute city concepts, they are a fantastic thing. Residents can access most of their daily needs, such as work, shopping, education, and recreation, within a 15-minute walk or bike ride from their homes. That would be an idealistic infrastructure that would render car ownership redundant for many in Brighton. It has nothing to do with parking restrictions, so your argument doesn’t make sense I’m afraid.
15 minute city? It already is, I can get everything I need within 15 minutes walk of my house.
Rather than complaining that you need to drive everywhere to get essentials in your race to the bottom, maybe turn it around: campaign for more services closer to where you live.
Well said John. Ensuring areas have everything they need locally sounds like an excellent criteria for city planning, especially prominent with the upturn in housing being built in Brighton this year.
Most of the suburbs of Brighton are not 15 minute cities, (North and South Portslade and Moulscoomb for example). 15 minute cities require the infrastructure before the idea and that is unlikely with the current financial situation. Allowances also need to be ensured as well for those with mobility issues. I have to say I am hugely skeptical of the idea.
As a thought experiment, what would you expect in a “15 minute city” that you can’t get within 15 minutes walk or cycle of Moulsecomb, for example?
It would be good if they enforced the existing ones properly and not let car hoarders off. Coldean has been plagued by car hoarders for years now and nothing gets done. Just put black tape over your plates and park in Selham Close. Never get a ticket old bill don’t give a toss. Makes you wonder why we pay tax.
Well, have you ever reported those vehicles in question? I find experiences like this bizarre, because whenever I see something like this in my area, I talk to relevant people, and things get done about it. What’s the difference when I do it?
We perform surgery on rockets now?
As usual, a huge number of comments from the petrolheads on any car related story, sad that they don’t seem to have any other interests.
These cars have been reported to the council, the police and DVLA on numerous occasions, and nothing is done. It’s a disgrace.